00:00.00 archpodnet Check that it's picking up my thing if it is good hello and welcome to episode 12 of t break time travel I'm your host Matilda Zeprech and today I'm s savoring a spiced black tea because even though it's November we're past halloweve and I love Christmas so I'm getting into the Christmas spirit early this year and joining me on my t-break today is musician and metalsmith Samuel Merrick and are you also on tea today. 00:27.81 Samuel Ah, no I don't have any tea or hot drinks I'm not a very ah tea person I would say. 00:33.78 archpodnet Ah, you're the second guest who's come on and said I don't actually drink tea. But do you I mean just from looking at your work and everything I can imagine I don't know a pint of mead or something among the. 00:48.70 Samuel Um, now I prefer to not be under the influence of our goal while while walking. 00:53.27 archpodnet Perfect that true yes, working around hot metal. Probably not a good idea. Um and indeed so as I mentioned so you are a metsmith and a musician so you're how I found you and how I know of you is ah. Through your work with now I realized when I was looking this up that I don't actually know how to say this word out loud. Um I've written it many times. Is it Karnix? yeah, okay, perfect I realized I was spelling it wrong like my whole life. So I was saying like Karinx and. 01:18.13 Samuel Yes, cornexs and. 01:26.90 Samuel Ah, okay. 01:28.20 archpodnet With the why and the anyway. So yes, Karnis and so that seems sort of very specific. How did you get into that that kind of idea so prehistoric metal working and music combination. 01:40.99 Samuel It's all started in 2019 ah when I applied for a job in the Gare Lake village age where I still work now a friend of of mine and was the blacksmith of this village age. And he lived so I went to apply as a blacksmith because I was doing blacksmithing on my own for something like 6 so five years and um, then they told me they are are a blacksmith and they proposed me to go for coppersmith but I never did before. And at the same time. The um, the manager of the of the village told me they wanted to make ah conics for for the village and of course I knew what was this instrument I knew a little bit about it and I was very excited excited about it. So ah, they told me oh to make coppers smithth coopersmithing I did a few exercise by basic things and then it was pretty easy because I had blacksmith's but background and so at some point I started to work. 02:45.95 archpodnet Um. 02:49.67 Samuel On the the connics to make research researches to understand how it was made first and I made the first prototype in 2019 and then the the season that the village stopped because it stopped at the um at the beginning of the ah of the fall the autumn. And when I went back home I wanted to make one conics for myself. So I met ah more which research is and I finally made a first walking prototype of. 03:22.20 archpodnet Amazing. So it was you said that you started with blacksmithing and I mean from what I have very limited experience with this but from what I remember of blacksmithing and copper working. They're very different metal working techniques right. 03:37.98 Samuel Yes, yes, blacksmithing so it's walking with hot iron or Orte and ah corpersmithing. It's like Teen Smith in english it's working with ah sheets layers of ah. Of copper based ah a allowi metals like brass brons copper and you work mostly cold instead of of the of the blacksmith thing where you you work with hot metal and. 04:07.89 archpodnet Um, and would you say then it took you I mean obviously I don't want you to say if 1 ne's harder than the other for example, but I mean for example, if you know how to do blacksmithing is it easier to pick up. Coppersmithing then maybe vice versa or are they fairly comparable in terms of the skills you need. 04:25.34 Samuel No I would say it definitely helped me to have made blacksmiths blacksmith thing before because you work with hammers with pair of tongues. Also. And you have unit fire Also at some point for for warm up the you metal tool and copsmithing. So ah, it was the same tools. Basically. And the the same way of holding a hammer and so yes, it helped to to have made some blocksmithing before. 04:58.74 archpodnet And did you also then kind of specialize when you were doing it as I guess a hobby before did you specialize in historic or prehistoric techniques as well or were you working as like ah a modern blacksmith or or hobbying. Um as a modern blacksmith. 05:12.35 Samuel No I'm working as a modern blacksmiths and coppersmith ah because walking like they did in the iron age is very hard I mean I'm alone in my workshop and they weren't obviously because there is a lot. 05:24.14 archpodnet Are. 05:28.94 Samuel Ah, if if you don't have power tools or or Torch Gay cast flames. You need to be many people working to have a workflow and to to be able to to to do the steps that you do now along with power tools. 05:37.86 archpodnet Are. 05:46.65 archpodnet Um, yeah, no, that's true I hadn't really thought of that before because indeed when I My very small experience I had with Blacksmith think my husband then boyfriend at the time came along to be the bellows boy and do the bellows and everything and yeah so I guess you need a lot of. 05:56.59 Samuel Oh yeah, now for example, it's the welding the the cornice the cornices are welded with ah Tin and nowadays we use a torch flame and a tin wire. And the and the project to clean the the the metal before welding but back in time they they had to use ah fames of candles and also ah red hot barges of steel to warm up the metal and it was it. 06:20.17 archpodnet Are. 06:28.73 Samuel Might have been very difficult because today it's not very easy to to master Tin welding properly with modern tools. So I don't even want to imagine how all they did back in time. Yeah. 06:38.62 archpodnet A lot of burns I Imagine a very thick leather but but did you also because that well I won't give too much away because we're going to talk about it in a second but the the specialty that you're looking at is from a. 06:47.45 Samuel Um, yeah, sorry. 06:54.20 archpodnet Ah, Prehistoric and historic time period were you always interested in those time periods. 06:59.79 Samuel I used before to to work at this relates I used to be ah, very into ah medieval things Medieval Music Medieval History Medieval things. 07:04.00 archpodnet Are. 07:09.70 Samuel And then we working in this village opened my eyes on the on the protohistoric and pretoric and iron age times and sorry what was your question? yeah. 07:17.17 archpodnet Yeah, no knowing indeed if you if you already had an in an interest in that because you said indeed that you worked you went to work at this village and volunteer. So I wondered if it was just because of the blacksmithing position or if the village itself held interest. 07:30.43 Samuel No yeah I was was very into medieval medieval stuff and and then I I tried to get interested in in prestoric stuff and I runage stuff because of of that work. 07:44.27 archpodnet Oh no, that's really fascinating and I think you might be the first guest I have who's more from a european perspective at these who's who's ah, not just prehistory because I have to admit probably I'm a little biased in most of the objects I pick a from prehistory so because I am a prehistorian. 07:54.15 Samuel Um, and. 08:00.69 archpodnet So that's really interesting to have someone from from both perspectives and on that note, if you could travel back in time where do you think you would go and why. 08:04.63 Samuel Um, who. 08:10.28 Samuel Ah I Will definitely go to neolithic. Ah, the the end of of paleolithic and and maybe also the Bronze Age. It's time Periods I Really like because it's full of mystery. And it's also the beginning. Ah the the starting point of our ah modern society nowadays and it will be very interesting to see um how people or society was organized at the time. 08:42.92 Samuel And also for the bronze age. It's because I really love ah the Bronze metal itself and all the things it represss in terms of ah of transforming the societies and also the way of working the the metal itself. 08:57.95 archpodnet Yeah, you could see how they were doing with the what you were talking about before with welding the pieces together. Well thank you very very much for joining me on my tbroke today and before we look at today's object which we've already mentioned a little bit. We're first going to journey back this time to 100 Bc 09:02.45 Samuel Yeah, yeah. 09:16.44 archpodnet To iron age and now I'm probably going to mispronounce this town taton yak maybe dantonac? Yes, um in France high school french didn't let me down. Um, and unlike our usual peaceful journeys to the past this one is filled with noises smells emotions. 09:20.71 Samuel Dantanyak. 09:32.11 archpodnet Hundreds of people fill the space the smell of sweat blood mud permeates the air screams and cries and the clashing of metal on metal metal on leather metal cleaving through skin. But then suddenly there's another sound a loud blasting call that reverberates around the hills and within every head. Looking up to the top of the nearby hill you see a line of figures each one blowing into the end of a around two meter long bronze horn. Each horn is topped with a beautifully crafted head wide ears carved eyes gaping jaws from which emits the blasting noise and that's what we're looking at today which is. Indeed as I've recently discovered a karennix not a karings. Um and we'll get into the details soon. But first I always like to have a look at the most asked questions on the internet and this is when I realized I've been spelling it wrong because I was looking up karings and nothing was coming up and I was going. How is this possible surely sure. 10:09.79 Samuel Um. 10:20.49 Samuel Um, and head hack. 10:26.97 archpodnet Something exists on Google about the Carricks and then I realized how way it's not. It's the carnis. So anyway here are the questions first one is ah what does a carex sound like which as you have created replicas samuel I imagine you have a boat. Okay. 10:42.47 Samuel Oh hello. 10:44.30 archpodnet Um, just going to say that again because I think we lost connection. Um, so the first question is what does a carnix sound like which as you have created some a couple of different replicas now. Ah, it's gone. Okay I will just pause. 10:47.44 Samuel I A I can hear you anymore I don't know if you can hear me you got kicked out.